Joining the resistance to create openings (Josh Braun, Founder @ Josh Braun Sales Training)

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1. 3:37

   So here's how that might sound. Someone says to you, cold calling is dead. And you might say this. There are so many more ways to reach out to prospects. People hate being interrupted, especially on a cold call. “It's such a time suck calling people and maybe you have one or two conversations and people don't even like it because you're interrupting them.” What we're doing here is we're joining people. It doesn't mean we have to agree with people, but we're joining them where they are. And then what you typically hear when you do that is people leaning forward. You get me. That's right. And then you might pile it on even more. You might say something like this.

   In Cost per meeting and efficiency

2. 8:24

   isn't to talk people into things. Your job is to shine a light on a problem that people might not know they had that can hurt them. And to do it in a subtle way that gets people to scratch their head and think, Hmm, I'm not sure. What do you know “that your prospect doesn't know that can hurt them? What is the cost of inaction? If your” prospect does nothing, what happens? So that'll be my third tip, which is shine a light on a problem and let people come to their own conclusions is a really good way to start conversations with people that are not actively in market. And that's like 90% of people you reach out to. If they were in market, they'd be calling you and your competitors.

   In Cost-of-inaction messaging

3. 8:36

   that gets people to scratch their head and think, Hmm, I'm not sure. What do you know that your prospect doesn't know that can hurt them? What is the cost of inaction? If your prospect does nothing, what happens? So that'll be my third tip, which is shine a light on a “problem and let people come to their own conclusions is a really good way to start” conversations with people that are not actively in market. And that's like 90% of people you reach out to. If they were in market, they'd be calling you and your competitors. So Josh, well, one, that could have been an episode on its own. Look at that killer open tips. So let's, let's go to the number two, which is the topic of having fun. And obviously we're

   In Pain-point messaging

4. 9:40

   should we be doing instead to have a little bit more fun? Yeah. So someone says, I'm not interested. We could talk a little bit about this. The cause of I'm not interested is the salesperson's message. Typically what happens when you hear that is the salesperson is saying something “that leads the prospect to believe that what they have is already getting the job done, or you're” not talking to the right person. So a lot of this is how you're structuring your cold call script. It's a little off topic. We could certainly get into it, but so many of these objections I hear call me in six months. I already have something for that. That's not an objection. They do have something for that. If someone says, I'm not Not interested, that means you're not interesting, the thing that you said is not interesting.

   In Belief-based messaging

5. 10:09

   It's a little off topic. We could certainly get into it, but so many of these objections I hear call me in six months. I already have something for that. That's not an objection. They do have something for that. If someone says, I'm not Not interested, that means you're not interesting, the thing that you said is not interesting. And the traditional sales approach is to say something like this, why aren't you interested? “And that word why is a tough one, because why can sound very confrontational.” It's almost like you're being scolded by a teen, like, why didn't you clean up your room? Why didn't you do your homework? So if someone says, I'm not interested, what I might say is this, in a very calm voice, I apologize for being so irrelevant, clearly, I need to work on my sales skills before

   In Objection response frameworks

6. 10:26

   And that word why is a tough one, because why can sound very confrontational. It's almost like you're being scolded by a teen, like, why didn't you clean up your room? Why didn't you do your homework? So if someone says, I'm not interested, what I might say is this, in a very calm voice, “I apologize for being so irrelevant, clearly, I need to work on my sales skills before” I get off the phone, if I'm not asking too much, is it because what I'm saying is completely off base? Or is my timing awful? So what I'm doing here is I'm going to take the blame, I'm going to take some responsibility. And typically, what you'll hear when you say that is, well, I'm not the person even responsible

   In Not-interested objections

7. 14:54

   And the reason it was different was for a couple reasons. One, you never had to leave your house to get it. Two, it was made out of Japanese steel that lasted 10 years without having to be sharpened. And three, it was 200 bucks. And they sold a ton of those knives. So many salespeople are selling knives. I got a knife. They don't have the unique mechanism. “So you have to start with the unique mechanism.” And the infomercial test is the best way that I know to get clarity on that. And Armand, I know you talk about this a lot, which I love this idea of problem training, not product training. And so many salespeople don't get that. They're like, we got a knife. It's a sharp knife. It's made of Japanese. I got a knife. I got a knife. So it's it starts

   In Mechanism-led messaging

8. 15:04

   And three, it was 200 bucks. And they sold a ton of those knives. So many salespeople are selling knives. I got a knife. They don't have the unique mechanism. So you have to start with the unique mechanism. And the infomercial test is the best way that I know to get clarity on that. And Armand, I know you talk about this a lot, which I love this idea of problem training, “not product training. And so many salespeople don't get that. They're like, we got a knife.” It's a sharp knife. It's made of Japanese. I got a knife. I got a knife. So it's it starts with that. And from there, we could then start to develop a talk track over the phone, which we can get into if you want. That's based on a mini discovery call rather than a pitch. So Josh, I love this concept of you're saying you're running a microcosm of a discovery

   In Product and ICP training

9. 15:18

   And Armand, I know you talk about this a lot, which I love this idea of problem training, not product training. And so many salespeople don't get that. They're like, we got a knife. It's a sharp knife. It's made of Japanese. I got a knife. I got a knife. So it's it starts with that. And from there, we could then start to develop a talk track over the phone, which “we can get into if you want. That's based on a mini discovery call rather than a pitch.” So Josh, I love this concept of you're saying you're running a microcosm of a discovery call. You're running a mini discovery call. Let's blow this out to the full discovery call. So let's say I jump onto this discovery call, post cold call, or maybe a demo request. And I know this person is using something that is not descript. How do you think about

   In Call scripts and talk tracks

10. 19:06

    can kind of say, Hey, I got to go. You know, I don't know if this is even worth a conversation or pullback. If you'd like, I can send you a little six minute video. You can check it out. And if you think it looks interesting, we can continue the conversation. No worries. And about a hundred percent of the time, someone says, sure. And usually says, well, wait, while I have you on the phone, how does it work? Rather than let's book a meeting, let's book a meeting. That's “certainly one outcome, but we have different tools that we can use here in these situations.” Same thing with the discovery call and then a logical output to that, which is, Hey, you know what? We can't address that. You're right. We're not a fit. And that's a perfectly okay, reasonable outcome because the goal here is to get to the truth. And the truth might be, it's not a fit rather than assuming it's a fit for everyone. And that's kind of

    In Replies and meetings

11. 23:54

    You might agree that the broken pixel on your TV is a problem, but it's not a big enough problem in your life. How do you make that transition from, Hey, live commenting is something that your current editor doesn't have to, Hey, this actually impacts your success as a podcast. How do you make this bigger? “So it actually is something that is big enough that they're willing to make that change.” I love that. So let's talk about this. That's not your prospect's job. That's your job as a salesperson. So let's make this real tangible. So if you're a triathlon coach and you are having a conversation with a triathlete as

    In Cost-of-inaction messaging

12. 31:17

    It's your job to tell people what could happen to their organization if they don't solve this problem. Don't always ask them to self-diagnose. And then lastly, number four, whenever you get slammed with these objections, guys, it's so tempting to push back, to stammer, to pitch, whatever it is. Don't be afraid to use a little bit of humor. “The best thing you can do is when you get slammed with, I'm not interested, is agree” with them and laugh and say, hey, I probably screwed up this cold call. I got to rework my pitch. That opener clearly didn't work. All righty, Nick, those are our four how could people help us out? Audience, are you aware? Have you considered that Armand and I fill the gaping voids in our lives by reading reviews

    In Not-interested objections